EGR system on MQ

EGR system on MQ

Postby shortSteve on Sat Jun 06, 2015 2:38 pm

Ok, so doing a bit more "pre" homework with a look to purchasing one, after reading some technical specs on the MQ engine I see it has both DPF (not a problem, do a lot of highway driving so should regenerate no issues...I hope) and an EGR system.
Now, initially I thought the engine architecture was the same as the Outlander diesel (just bore/stroke difference) but have been informed, that, no, all/most ancillary systems are not the same, including manifolds. So, after some asking around/net searches, I see that the Outlander diesel does not suffer the carboning up issues familiar to some MN or Paj owners, but in such a new car (MQ) where mods to increase reliability are yet to be made, was wondering if the manifold design is such that carboning up/soot deposits are eliminated or greatly reduced over the MN?
Any one know anything???

Cheers in advance.

sS
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Re: EGR system on MQ

Postby mattz on Sun Jun 07, 2015 6:15 am

shortSteve wrote:Ok, so doing a bit more "pre" homework with a look to purchasing one, after reading some technical specs on the MQ engine I see it has both DPF (not a problem, do a lot of highway driving so should regenerate no issues...I hope) and an EGR system.
Now, initially I thought the engine architecture was the same as the Outlander diesel (just bore/stroke difference) but have been informed, that, no, all/most ancillary systems are not the same, including manifolds. So, after some asking around/net searches, I see that the Outlander diesel does not suffer the carboning up issues familiar to some MN or Paj owners, but in such a new car (MQ) where mods to increase reliability are yet to be made, was wondering if the manifold design is such that carboning up/soot deposits are eliminated or greatly reduced over the MN?
Any one know anything???

Cheers in advance.

sS

I can not answer your question with knowledge of the MQ but........

I'd say the triton (ML and MN) were just a bad design. You have to remember all modern diesels are suffering from this carbon build up the triton suffered from it earlier than most.
The Pajero doesn't suffer from it nearly as bad either,but has had its own issues with DPF on some models. :roll:

These anti pollution systems are a relatively new requirement to vehicles due to euro emission standards and their staggered reduction of pollution.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/European ... standards#
This is making it harder for vehicle designers that have to produce a vehicle that meets the standard or they can't sell it and then the standards are changed and made harder to meet.
Unfortunately this has meant the designers have been learning along the way, to a certain extent and have made designs that could have been better. :roll: I think the triton falls into this category. :lol:

With other models in the Mitsubishi range it shows that they can produce vehicles that don't suffer accelerated carbon build up.

I'd say Mitsubishi now know what works and what doesn't and won't make the same design mistakes twice......but stranger things have happened. :lol:

Like most new things, they will iron out the bugs and improve over time.......I remember when you wouldn't touch a turbo car due to blowing turbos and seals and the high costs of replacement.



I've recently been truck shopping and was speaking to a service manager who is of the opinion to meet future euro emission standards all vehicles will have to run DPF, EGRs and Adblue :shock:

I say roll the dice and take the plunge and let us know what you think. :lol:
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Re: EGR system on MQ

Postby Aquagen0 on Sun Jun 07, 2015 9:28 am

I know the maf sensor is a different plug to the Mn after looking in the engine bay at the dealer. Means you can't use Tony's mod to electricly block the egr. So mine is for sale on gumtree
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Re: EGR system on MQ

Postby Tony on Sun Jun 07, 2015 9:59 am

Correct, the sensor is much smaller, I have a mold for it already as same some other makes.
We are working on something for off road race only. ;)
EGR system is very different compared to the predecessor as is the Engine management.

The EGR system looks like it should be a lot more reliable to me due to way it works, size and location. Looks almost heavy as the alloy engine block. :lol:


DPF is also in a better position compared to old Pajero set up. I can see two advantages, one the exhaust gas temps drop very quickly once past the turbo (So DPF will burn at lower EGTS) and my main thinking is a DPF located underneath a 4X4 is nothing more than a fire hazard in long dry grass and/or grass seeds etc.
MQ having the DPF fitted behind the turbo and not under the vehicle will minimize the risk. A big consideration to farmers and remote off road travelers.
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Re: EGR system on MQ

Postby Aquagen0 on Sun Jun 07, 2015 10:36 am

Excellent news Tony. I'd prefer to keep my manifold clean no matter how improved the egr design is.
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Re: EGR system on MQ

Postby Stoneman on Sun Jun 07, 2015 4:48 pm

Dosent the dpf need to reach certain temps for it to be able to incinerate the soot?

I would be thinking the temps are similar during the burn as the Pajero

Is it a open type or closed type dpf system

Closed type runs the temp and pressure sensors.

Is the DPF just after the turbo where the cat sits on our MN's?
Last edited by Stoneman on Mon Jun 08, 2015 5:55 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: EGR system on MQ

Postby Tony on Sun Jun 07, 2015 6:41 pm

Stoneman wrote:Dosent the dpf need to reach certain temps for it to be able to incinerate the soot?

I would be thinking the temps are similar during the burn as the Pajero

Is it a open type or closed type dpf system like NT Pajero I think

Closed type runs the temp and pressure sensors.

Is the DPF just after the turbo where the cat sits on our MN's?


Pajero run Active DPF and can see scary temps pre turbo during regeneration. Over 800c :shock:

I did not explain it well. What I typed reads like DPF works cooler, not the case but engines EGT's will less to start a DPF regeneration due to lower thermal losses as per the DPF location.

From what have seen, the MQ appears to run an active system even though the MQ's DPF is located pretty much where the catalytic converter was on other models (Most DPF systems located close to the turbo work passive only and purely rely on higher temps under load to force regeneration), the temperature drop will be much less compared to systems located further back under the vehicle.

Either way, a DPF (or catalytic converter also) can be a fire hazard in my opinion and having it located as MQ triton will help minimize the risk should you be under heavy engine load in long grass etc.

I doubt we will see many issues with this DPF up unless the car is driven less than 20 minutes a day on average.

Anyway, back to the OP's EGR question. Sorry for taking off topic.
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Re: EGR system on MQ

Postby s13tsilvia on Sun Jun 07, 2015 8:16 pm

So I best stay away. I drive 5 days a week to train station 5 mins away. Weekends are normally some driving some no driving?
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Re: EGR system on MQ

Postby hvac guy on Sun Jun 07, 2015 9:19 pm

Time to lycra up then ^^^^^^
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Re: EGR system on MQ

Postby Tony on Sun Jun 07, 2015 9:20 pm

I wouldn't write it off on above.

Five minute runs certainly wont help the regeneration process, but such low kilometers will also take a long time before the DPF will be requiring regeneration.

The occasional weekend longer runs should save you. Otherwise a forced burn can be done by the dealer when serviced should it be required.
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Re: EGR system on MQ

Postby Stoneman on Mon Jun 08, 2015 5:46 am

By active you mean closed type with sensors (controlled by ECU)

And passive is the open type system using no sensors but the exhaust gases? (Not controlled by ECU)


From the Pajero manual, An open type system

The open flow type DPF does not have the DPF regeneration control by the engine-ECU. The forced regeneration or maintenance, therefore, is not necessary. The two kinds of the exhaust gas passages are in the DPF. Only one of them has the filter collecting the particulate matter (PM). The DPF regenerations begins when the inside DPF temperature gets higher depending on the engine operating conditions. And then the PM collected in the filter is burned. During the DPF regeneration, the high temperature exhaust gas is emitted as the DPF temperature gets higher.

Closed type

Through the input signal sent from each sensor, the engine-ECU anticipates the amount of particulate matter (PM) accumulated in the DPF. Taking control of automatically regenerating the DPF under the certain condition, the engine-ECU removes the PM when the PM accumulates more than the standard. At the DPF regeneration, the DPF temperature is higher and the high temperature exhaust gas discharges.

IMO you don't want a closed type system.

More info here if anyone interested under technical information

http://faq.out-club.ru/download/pajero_ ... dex_M2.htm

Would be great to see a technical discussion on this I run a chip in I'm NS and have some questions on how the chip effects it :D
Back on topic.....
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Re: EGR system on MQ

Postby s13tsilvia on Mon Jun 08, 2015 12:34 pm

hvac guy wrote:Time to lycra up then ^^^^^^

Too cold for that lol
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