Low sulfur Diesel benefits Fact or Friction ?

[leonbee]

Hydrotreating is the cheapest process to remove sulfur. Treating with hydrogen reduces the lubrication properties of the end product diesel causing accelerated wear to fuel system components.

Premeture fuel injection system failure due to low lubricity diesel fuels is not covered by warranty.

Mitsubishi Manual quote: CAUTION: Failure resulting from the use of any non recommended fuels are not warrantable defects and therefore the cost of repairs will not be covered by MITSUBISHI MOTORS warranty.

I hope the additives the suppliers are adding to low sulphur diesel is working. It May be a good idea to keep a history/copies of fuel purchase recieipts should a claim arise.

[rodeddy]

I wrote this in a previous thread ....

Our current sulphur spec is 10PPM which is the ultra low suplur specs required. In fact, what comes out the refinery is usually about 8PPM.
Since we dropped, from the very old 200PPM sulphur spec , down to 50PPM from about 2007 then to the current 10PPM around 2010/11, i would assume that some manufactures handbooks would be out of date on which oil grade to use, as they would be basing oil specs on the better lubricating older higher sulphur fuels.
Since the introduction of ultra low sulphur fuels, the oil specs have had to change to meet extra/ better lubrication and to meet emmison control std.
Actually, i would be interested to see whether the oil spec recommended from Mitsubishi has changed from, say 2006 to the current handbook. If anyone could look. maybe not ?? interesting though
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Hydrotreating is the cheapest process to remove sulfur. Treating with hydrogen reduces the lubrication properties of the end product diesel causing accelerated wear to fuel system components.

Premeture fuel injection system failure due to low lubricity diesel fuels is not covered by warranty.

Mitsubishi Manual quote: CAUTION: Failure resulting from the use of any non recommended fuels are not warrantable defects and therefore the cost of repairs will not be covered by MITSUBISHI MOTORS warranty.

I hope the additives the suppliers are adding to low sulphur diesel is working. It May be a good idea to keep a history/copies of fuel purchase recieipts should a claim arise.

[chrisdoherty87]

About every 3rd tank of fuel I run a 1:200 mix of diesel and 2 stroke oil. It makes the engine quieter, lubes up pumps and fuel system and I notice a small km increase in that tank as well. Google 2 stroke oil in diesel and you will find a lot of write ups about it. The oil must be of certain type of your going to try it. Myself and a lot of others tend to run castrol 2T. That's my way of compensating for our low Sulfur rate anyway.

[leonbee]

The Current manual Classification is API CF-4 we are up CJ-4. The higher the letter the longer the life/perf

This is the minimum manufacturers specification and will most likely has not changed. This is also what the dealer uses to make/save money. The idea is to meet the warranty period. I think 15,000km change is to long. Why, because the cheapest way for the manufacture to meet EPA rules is the exahust reserculation system and blowby which is crapping up the oil. Also the poor lubricty of low sulphur fuel.

If you want to keep your truck for a long time you should have your manufacture chang your oil at 7500km, provide your own oil or dump the oil and put better oil in yourself. However i would'nt recommend this as it will void your warranty.
I dont like long drain synthetics to expensive and I prefer the soot out the sooner the better.

Add an additive to the fuel??? The 2 stroke oil noted seems to be a cheap alternative and many here swear by it.
Low sulphur fuel pros and cons here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8F_dyWjYHHg

[rodeddy]

hi,
yes i put in Castrol 2T, 100ml with each tankful. I used to use 300ml but my catch can was filling up fast.

About every 3rd tank of fuel I run a 1:200 mix of diesel and 2 stroke oil. It makes the engine quieter, lubes up pumps and fuel system and I notice a small km increase in that tank as well. Google 2 stroke oil in diesel and you will find a lot of write ups about it. The oil must be of certain type of your going to try it. Myself and a lot of others tend to run castrol 2T. That's my way of compensating for our low Sulfur rate anyway.

[gazman152]

What about a flashlube type fuel lubricant? Does wonders for LPG / petrol powered engines.

[hvac guy]

I use flash lube and rate it highly can tell the difference every 5 tanks

[chrisdoherty87]

hi,
yes i put in Castrol 2T, 100ml with each tankful. I used to use 300ml but my catch can was filling up fast.

About every 3rd tank of fuel I run a 1:200 mix of diesel and 2 stroke oil. It makes the engine quieter, lubes up pumps and fuel system and I notice a small km increase in that tank as well. Google 2 stroke oil in diesel and you will find a lot of write ups about it. The oil must be of certain type of your going to try it. Myself and a lot of others tend to run castrol 2T. That's my way of compensating for our low Sulfur rate anyway.

Yeah I use about 250ml ever 3rd tank. Used to do it every tank but probably isn't needed.

[OffRoadDave]

hi,
yes i put in Castrol 2T, 100ml with each tankful. I used to use 300ml but my catch can was filling up fast.

You can attribute more combustion pressure bypassing the piston rings by adding 2T to the tank?

That's the only way I can make sense of the catch can filling up faster with more 2T being used in the fuel.

[chrisdoherty87]

Yes that is odd. I have noticed no difference with blow by.

[leonbee]

I use flash lube and rate it highly can tell the difference every 5 tanks

Lucas (American) $20 a litre recommends 100ml per tank = $2 a fill

I noticed flash lube at super cheap an Australian copy of Lucas $60.00 for 5 litres = $1.20 per fuel fill.

Castrol 2T $40 for 4 litres = $2.00 a fill at (200ml) $1.00 a fill at (100ml)
Golf western who provides lube to mines at $20 for 5 litres = .80cents a fill

I think it should be added to each fill to increase the lubricity of low sulphur diesel for fuel system and rings.
About $50 bucks a year....

[leonbee]

BP Diesel Ultimate fact sheet 1st May 2010 (current)

Lubricity wear scar diameter 0.46 max

It meets the requirements of BB EN 590 and ASTM for Lubricity.
1) Includes a Lubricity additive
2) Includes a detergent additive to clean fouled injectors
3) Includes an additive to reduce foaming and splashback

BP Guarantees that this product is fit for purpose described above, and meets all legislative requirements. BP reserves the right to vary this specification from time to time without notice provided the product continues to meets legislative requirements.

[leonbee]

New Lubricity Challenges

Regional lubricity requirements for diesel fuels, defined by wear scar diameter limits, have been introduced to ensure that, despite this increasing complexity, fuels continue to deliver the required level of hardware protection.
– although average levels are still below the World Fuels Charter recommended level of 400

microns.https://www.infineuminsight.com/insight ... challenges



.

[leonbee]

Note BP above: Lubricity, corrected wear scar diameter is 460 and the recommended Global target is level is 400. In America diesel is worse at 500.

Just purchase some BP Ultimate and some cheap after market diesel.
$1.39 After market diesel is clear with a hint of kero look. Froff when you shake it. No info or data sheet, probably is kero. The console monkey was'nt much help thought I said donuts and coffee.
$1.55 BP Ultimate is yellow looks like someone Pis...d in it or put some 2 stroke oil in it. Shook jar and no froff, Has a nice smell gives you a nice fuzzy feeling.

Note BP above meets the requirements of BB EN 590 and ASTM for Lubricity
Sticker on Triton fuel cap states EN590.

So yep I will be using BP and keeping receipts should I have warranty issues. Occassionally chuck in some 2 stroke or Pi.s in it some more just to be on the safe side.

Lov that car....

[Monkeyz]

I can attest to Flashlube being bloody good, approx 100ml per tank load and I pay about 20 bucks per lt so $2 per tank added to Caltex Vortex, damn engine is almost quiet and the rattle is now a minor back ground noise, fuel economy is good too boot. everything just feels smoother.

Having said this I have tried other additives even 2 stroke and have not had these sort of results...

Mojo...

[AnOldFart]

Googled 'Flashlube Diesel' and found this 'interesting' little discussion about fuel additives from a few years back over on the Hyundai i30 Owners Forum. If you overlook some 'ordinary' spelling going on through the thread it makes interesting reading. Is the dude right about the 'composition' of Flashlube ....? Don't ask me but it sounds feasible.

http://www.i30ownersclub.com/forum/inde ... pic=7087.0

Personally speaking, my own old girl (2010 MN) has been running --very sweetly-- over the last 15K ever since I started to add 300ml of Castrol 2T to every full tank refill of Caltex Vortex Dino-Jooce. Prior to that she was beginning to behave badly, ie, running rough, misfiring, and liked to belch out large black smelly smokey farts, all over the poor sod who was unfortunate enough to be lined up behind me when taking off at the traffic lights ... Since starting the 2T routine she's been behaving like a saint ....

[leonbee]

Interesting read

I experimented and found by adding a small amount of napha (shellite to kero) I got a cleaner burn for my kero Lantern that is no soot and the flame lasted longer. I also found that diggers white spirits is the same as diggers shellite but cheaper. Keeps the generator in my Lantern clean of soot.

As noted in your link this is what diesel injector fuel cleaners is most likely to be Napha and some oil. So my above proof napha added to diesel will clean injectors and give a better burn but for what price to a high pressure diesel fuel pump, maybe to much friction. (100ml is 1,5ml per Litre thinning of oily diesel)

T2
Diesel is oily and adding more oil 2T may help but Concerns with this is the other additives designed for 2 stroke engines and its effect on the fuel pump. However no concerns noted by users of 2T some for years and many Km.

Also noted earlier in the thread the big companies claim they have spent allot of money researching and still have not found a suitable Lubricant to meet the target of the removed sulphur lubricity effectively.

However look at this research snippet:
Biodiesel fuels consisting of methyl esters of soybean oil had excellent scuffing and
adhesive wear resistance that exceeds those of the best conventional diesel fuels.”

[rodeddy]

we have up to 5% biodiesel in our std diesel anyhow ....maybe this little amount help enough ???

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However look at this research snippet:
Biodiesel fuels consisting of methyl esters of soybean oil had excellent scuffing and
adhesive wear resistance that exceeds those of the best conventional diesel fuels.”[/quote]

[leonbee]

[quote="rodeddy"]we have up to 5% biodiesel in our std diesel anyhow ....maybe this little amount help enough ???

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I don't think we do it would have to be stated like petrol E1o. Anyone confirm this?

It appears Mitsubishi does not agree with the lubrication benifits of FAME. From my 2014 owners manual.

The use of FAME (Fatty Acid Methyl Ester) not conforming to EN14214 and more than 5% concentration may lead to damage to your vehicle fuel pump.

BP makes a Bidiesel fuel with a consentration of 5%. Claims it is not a biodiesel due to the small amount. It said fuel consumption is slightly more but should not be noticable under normal driving conditions.

So is it the answer to the poor lubrication of Low sulphur Diesel. Your Guess is as good as mine

[rodeddy]

.... they can blend up to max of 5% biodiesel in without requiring to label it . Anymore than 5% and it requires to be labelled...

[leonbee]

American Blind test study of fuel system Lubricity…
1st 2% regular soypower biodiesel
415 micron improvement

2nd Opti-Lube XPD (American)
Multi-purpose + anti-gel
cetane improver, demulsifier, 319 micron improvement.
7th place Outboard 2-cycle oil 162 micron improvement
(could damage ULSD compliant Diesels systems)

8th Lubricity fuel additive containing 5% bio-diesel, alcohol free
157 micron improvement

13th Used motor oil (yep only in America folks)
2 micron (could damage ULSD compliant Diesels systems)

14th Lucus upper cylinder Lubricant 5 micron less than baseline
(Believe it or not! Same as flash lube)

15th Multipurpose canola oil based additive
8 micron less than baseline

19th Primrose Power Blend
Multi-purpose Cetane boost, bio-diesel compatible, emulsifier
75 microns worse than baseline

[leonbee]

ABout this Study

Its all about the environment and profit folks the longivity of you truck is a small criteria.
The above study was done by some American 4WD clubs who pooled some money to get an independant test.
Shocking that some commercial product in fact increased the friction despite the claims. Not all listed as they are American products. The last product 19 no doubt contains alot of solvent.

Note the lab said 2 stroke oil is ok for old burners but may damage high pressure ULS systems.

Note the added bio is good for cleaning and lubrication for ULS systems.

[leonbee]

BP Ultimate Diesel is 460 micron as noted in my earlier posts. Which is a 176 micron improvement in lubrication and meets manufacturers minimum specs.

Biodiesel wins 415 which is a 221 improvement, (Also better at cleaning)

2 stroke added comes in at 474 in the test at a 162 improvement.

Lucaus and flash lube 641 which is a 5% increase in wear

The last commercial fuel addative Primrose 771 was also 75 microns worse for wear.

EU is 460 and the US is 520 so why people say our fuel is crap I do not Know. The replacement target is 400

(sorry it was conducted by a Tractor club i.e farmers not a 4wd club)

[deermaster]

hi,
yes i put in Castrol 2T, 100ml with each tankful. I used to use 300ml but my catch can was filling up fast.

About every 3rd tank of fuel I run a 1:200 mix of diesel and 2 stroke oil. It makes the engine quieter, lubes up pumps and fuel system and I notice a small km increase in that tank as well. Google 2 stroke oil in diesel and you will find a lot of write ups about it. The oil must be of certain type of your going to try it. Myself and a lot of others tend to run castrol 2T. That's my way of compensating for our low Sulfur rate anyway.

Yeah I use about 250ml ever 3rd tank. Used to do it every tank but probably isn't needed.

Me too, I now use it every three or four tanks and give it a good dose. about 200 to 250mm a tankfull.

[leonbee]

Be aware 2 stroke is fine for older model donks, The new High pressure pumps designed for Ultra low sulphur diesel have a very tight tolerance. To much oil or to much solvent in fact may damage the system.

1:200 was the ratio used for this test. The lab suggested it could damage ULSD systems.
.
I would be inclined to half this to be on the safe side.