Another carrbon/ EGR blocking post

[Adonis]

Hi All,

Please forgive me as I have most likely asked what has been asked 1000 times in the carbon everybody has it problem post, but after sifting through 15 odd paged and getting the jist of what the G.O is, I still just want to make sure I am on the right track.

I have an 08 ML triton and after 45,000km my car was runnin like a pig. Went to the dealer they replaced manifold (unsure which one) and it drove like new until recent. Just done a 60,000km service and manifold (pretty sure top one) has been replaced and again it drives like a dream. My warranty is about to run out so going to block off this bl00dy EGR valve thing. I rang chip it and they recon the ML triton 3.2L will be fine to just blank the EGR so this is what I am going to do. Also going to run the rocker cover breather into a catch can with filter on top, no plumbing back into the engine BS. I haven't had time to check out the car properly but intend to saturday can someone tell me if one of these are the EGR flanges that need blocking off?



Thanks a lot guys!

[snowman]

you will most likely need a Chip-it module to avoid limp modes. mine survived for a few months without one but then they started and they became more and more regular. they are a pain in the neck, if not dangerous and you need to avoid them. I use an MRT tune to solve my limp mode problems but if i was you i would purchase and use the Chip-it module, even if only on a mild tune.

Some people use an alternative method with an EGR plate hole and other trickery (check longranger's posts). Each to his own but it still going to allow 'some' carbon through from what i can tell.

number 2 is the EGR blank location i use.

using a catch can is done by many and not by all. I don't. Some like the idea of oily film within the intake air stream, others don't. As long as the carbon is stopped you wont get the big black build up seen so often.

be prepared with some decent tools and patience if you have not removed the nuts before. might be worth trying some WD-40 or similar the night before - anything can help. i recall the one closest the fire wall was a biatch to undo the first time.

[big_bob_thefirst]

It's flange two in the picture. Or you can follow the pipe up and put it on the top of the heat exchanger (flange next to number 1).

[JoanTheSpark]

...
Some people use an alternative method with an EGR plate hole and other trickery (check longranger's posts). Each to his own but it still going to allow 'some' carbon through from what i can tell.
...

LR's (and sierra too I think) method is blocking it off mechanically too.. all he additionally does (instead of the chip it to avoid limp modes) is to have some air from after the intercooler enter the EGR piping AFTER the mechanical block, so the EGR valve for his car controlling not exhaust gas, but some intercooled charged air.
The mod is relatively elaborate though and needs some welding.

Other people cut the MAP sensor tube and add a t-section with a ball-valve that allows some engine bay air to enter the MAP sensor to avoid limp modes.. problem here might be reliability and if not done properly trouble at water crossings. The merit is that it's cheap and easy to do (if you're able to install a blanking plate).
Dunno if there has been a standard ball-valve and/or filter element yet to use though..

The only peoples that still get carbon in their manifolds are the ones who drilled their blanking plates to avoid limp modes.

Myself is aiming for a fully electronic solution, where the EGR+TB valve is being controlled by a microcontroller that also checks the MAP sensor and it will be plug and play.
Currently I'm waiting for the connectors (I hopes they're the correct ones, only ordered based on pictures ) and my scantool.. then it's data logging time.
Will keep you posted once I'm able to start.

[Adonis]

Thanks very much for your replies guys! This limp mode doesn't sound very good, I assume that it somehow shut some of the motor down?

I think I might have to bite the bullet on this one and get chip it to plug up the EGR and install one of their systems with a new tune to avoid these limp modes. Either that or sell my car! It drives beautifully at the moment after new manifold and being cleaned out so trying to avoid driving it until the carbon is blocked off!

[big_bob_thefirst]

I'd block of the EGR right now. I 've had my installed the last few weeks and no problems. If u do get limp modes, u can always look at additional fixes then.

The limp mode isn't too bad unless ur at high speed. Basically the engine won't rev over 2000rpm and gives a lack of power. Feels like a car with no turbo.

Ps, not that I'm trying to talk u out of getting a chip

[odie602r]

It's unlikely you'll be disappointed if you go the chip it route - IMO great value for the $$$, excellent increase in power/torque and infinitely tunable to get it just how you want it. Consider going for the EGT controller and fuel rail limiter to have the safety factor dialed in as well

Oh yeah, consider getting a scan gauge too, which can clear any codes or limp modes on the fly...

[mad992]

number 2 is where i blanked dont forget to drill 6mm hole to fool ecu because ML chuck limpys
catch can takes the moisture out of equation and keeps things clean but then everyone different
and some say 6mm hole defeats the purpose but i think differently and im happy

[irwazza]

Mine never threw a limp without a hole

[mad992]

Mine never threw a limp without a hole

mine went for 20000k then all of a sudden bang limpy

[irwazza]

Full block it and get yourself a scan tool to reset if required. A plate with a 6mm hole is definently better than nothing but its still more than likely going to block up.

[biggibbo]

Drill a 6mm hole in the flap on the throttle body and you will have no limpys and have 0 chance of carbon buildup

[Snooozy]

I have an ML 3.2 blanked at 3200km. catch can & chipit fitted later. I also have Scangauge.

I never had a limpy when the blank went in. Had a few after the chip, but that was mainly due to a faulty wiring loom.

If I was you I would blank ASAP & if $$ allow go for a scangauge (or similar) & chip

you wont be disappointed with the extra getup & go

& I do not see the point of drilling a hole in the blank-defeats the purpose in my opinion

[Mitstech2936]

Orrrr u could try using a low ash synthetic oil... Prevents the majority of the carbon buildup, u won't hafto worry about if your in the middle of the stix and you get the dreaded limp mode, also be careful with chipping especially in the 4d56 high power (2.5l) as the variable geometry turbo flips out big time to overboosting, the 4m41 and 4d56 are already pretty much at the peak of there operating parameters and "power upgrades" tend to spit turbos quick smart

[al coholic]

Orrrr u could try using a low ash synthetic oil... Prevents the majority of the carbon buildup, u won't hafto worry about if your in the middle of the stix and you get the dreaded limp mode

Ok, I'll bite I can appreciate your position working for Mitsu (assuming your username is correct) but with all due respect..........that answer is typical dealer BS that everyone is sick to death of hearing
What you are saying is "We acknowledge there is a serious problem with these EGR's....use a low ash synthetic oil, which wont PREVENT the problem we should be fixing.....but hopefully slow down the process and get you past the 5 yr warranty, then its not our problem any more"

The blanking plates and catch cans are both good solutions for those that WANT to be pro active about the problem

[srb]

Orrrr u could try using a low ash synthetic oil... Prevents the majority of the carbon buildup, u won't hafto worry about if your in the middle of the stix and you get the dreaded limp mode, also be careful with chipping especially in the 4d56 high power (2.5l) as the variable geometry turbo flips out big time to overboosting, the 4m41 and 4d56 are already pretty much at the peak of there operating parameters and "power upgrades" tend to spit turbos quick smart

Assuming from your user name and the context of post that your a dealer mechanic that drives a triton? Always good to hear what you guys have to say on here. So welcome.

Though I think there are a few non Mitsu Tec's on here that could even teach you a thing or two about these trucks. Lots of knowledge on here

[Mitstech2936]

Yeah correct I do work for a dealership, have done for 8 months now... I am not a boss nor am I a foreman, I
Am just the one who hasto actually fix the vehicles and see the problems, every 30k interval (valve lash adjustment and every repair order that I get in my intray that heads with "vehicle lacking power please inspect" has gross amounts of carbon buildup, and when I do the 30 k intervals on pajeros with rather sensitive DPF systems that require them to use low ash oils there intake systems even after 60-90k are in damn fine shape.... Only passing on knowledge not trying to cover up or make excuses... And as for the chip situation for extra power... Word of advise,
Take the bloody chip setup out completely before it gets bought in for an engine light or etc on... You will not get warranty on anything in powertrain if evidence of a chip etc has been added to vehicle

[srb]

Yeah correct I do work for a dealership, have done for 8 months now... I am not a boss nor am I a foreman, I
Am just the one who hasto actually fix the vehicles and see the problems, every 30k interval (valve lash adjustment and every repair order that I get in my intray that heads with "vehicle lacking power please inspect" has gross amounts of carbon buildup, and when I do the 30 k intervals on pajeros with rather sensitive DPF systems that require them to use low ash oils there intake systems even after 60-90k are in damn fine shape.... Only passing on knowledge not trying to cover up or make excuses... And as for the chip situation for extra power... Word of advise,
Take the bloody chip setup out completely before it gets bought in for an engine light or etc on... You will not get warranty on anything in powertrain if evidence of a chip etc has been added to vehicle

Good to have you blokes at the coal face of technical problems. Be prepared to be asked lots of questions. Not sure I agree on your chip comment It really depends on how It's set up and how you use it. Not all chips are the same. Most of us on here use the Chipit (forum sponsor) chips or Ecutec tune, both a very safe if set up right. There are a few on here that have taken these engines to their limits and are fully aware of the potential damage. Each to their own I guess. I know I wouldn't be with out it. I also service mine more frequently than what's recommend and like other on here have done little mod's to help keep it all reliable, such as egr blank and catch can. Great to hear your opinions though. Cheers.

[JoanTheSpark]

Yeah correct I do work for a dealership, have done for 8 months now... I am not a boss nor am I a foreman, I Am just the one who hasto actually fix the vehicles and see the problems, every 30k interval (valve lash adjustment and every repair order that I get in my intray that heads with "vehicle lacking power please inspect" has gross amounts of carbon buildup, and when I do the 30 k intervals on pajeros with rather sensitive DPF systems that require them to use low ash oils there intake systems even after 60-90k are in damn fine shape.... Only passing on knowledge not trying to cover up or make excuses...

And you can vouch for those pajeros not to have been blanked before they came to you?
I'm no mechanic, but wouldn't the pajero have a different engine with different intake, etc. that could cause this one to have less hassles?

[Cowboy Dave]

I've used low ash full synthetic oils pretty much from the outset but my manifold is still awfully gunked up at 50,000km. Sure MMAL will put on a new manifold this time, but what happens next time, or the time after that?

[curepipe]

Ive replaced 2 manifolds so far at 100k and at 200k

[snowman]

Yeah correct I do work for a dealership, have done for 8 months now... I am not a boss nor am I a foreman, I
Am just the one who hasto actually fix the vehicles and see the problems, every 30k interval (valve lash adjustment and every repair order that I get in my intray that heads with "vehicle lacking power please inspect" has gross amounts of carbon buildup, and when I do the 30 k intervals on pajeros with rather sensitive DPF systems that require them to use low ash oils there intake systems even after 60-90k are in damn fine shape.... Only passing on knowledge not trying to cover up or make excuses... And as for the chip situation for extra power... Word of advise,
Take the bloody chip setup out completely before it gets bought in for an engine light or etc on... You will not get warranty on anything in powertrain if evidence of a chip etc has been added to vehicle

Firstly welcome and we do appreciate your comments.
I assume at your dealership you use the same oil for both a Triton and a Pajero?
Many people on here, including me when it was newer and before i lost confidence in my dealership, use the local Mits dealership just like many pajero owners. I dont think you can state oil type as the difference between these two vehicle EGR performance. Sorry mate, i just can't agree with you.

[BrettJH]

Really interesting read guys. I'm in the process now of having a new top manifold fitted and lower manifold cleaned. I managed to get 180k k's done in my 3.2 triton before the surging started. Perhaps the fact that it's all country miles has helped it hold off for as long as it has. I am having the new upgraded manifold fitted where the sensor sits further up. I really can't believe there wasn't a recall with all the issues I have read since getting on 'new triton'.
After this is done, I'm going to fit the blocking plate and a chip it kite and with luck, no more problems. Should I drill a 6mm hole in the blocking plate just to be safe ? I just want to avoid any more problems down the track. Really what is best with this issue?
Another thing I thought interesting was the mention of a scan gauge. They sound a great idea ESP if having a problem and being able to reset the limp home mode or work out what going on with the car. Where can you buy them, what model and how much is one that would be set up to work on the Triton ?
All that aside, I'm only new to this forum over the last week, but I now know more about my vehicle in that week than I have over the period that I have owned it. Thanks to all for great comment, thought and fix it ideas. I really appreciate all the comments which have pointed me into the direction of keeping my car and enjoying it.
" I just love that car !"

[Mitstech2936]

Firstly... What I said was just a suggestion, not the be all and end all to fix it, just what I have picked up from pulling a million of these things apart weekly, let me tell you when I went from building hypo chevs at home for other racer mates that I race with to starting for Mitsi it was a rude shock to see a carboned up egr and manifold!! The triton and pajero and challenger all get the same oil treatment unless the pajero has a sensored DPF system... Then it gets low ash... Both same engines in some.. 3.2l 4M41 and some Tritons and challengers get the 4D56 2.5l, now what I have picked up on is the pajero with the mobil 1 low ash was a lot cleaner engine... Same goes for the Mercedes and the jeeps that I unfortunately hafto work on also... Was speaking with another tech at work and he has put an oil catch can on his and running low ash oil and it has prevented the carbon buildup in his 2.5... It's taken the soot outta the system and the oil away thy sticks it to all surfaces...
I haven't dealt with or seen the chip-it kit so might be one worth suggesting to the boys at work that wanna do it, the common one I see and have nO end of drama with is predominantly the steinbauer

[snowman]

Firstly... What I said was just a suggestion, not the be all and end all to fix it, just what I have picked up from pulling a million of these things apart weekly, let me tell you when I went from building hypo chevs at home for other racer mates that I race with to starting for Mitsi it was a rude shock to see a carboned up egr and manifold!! The triton and pajero and challenger all get the same oil treatment unless the pajero has a sensored DPF system... Then it gets low ash... Both same engines in some.. 3.2l 4M41 and some Tritons and challengers get the 4D56 2.5l, now what I have picked up on is the pajero with the mobil 1 low ash was slot cleaner engine... Same goes for the Mercedes and the jeeps that I unfortunately hafto work on also... Was speaking with another tech at work and he has put an oil catch can on his and running low ash oil and it has prevented the carbon buildup in his 2.5... It's taken the soot outta the system and the oil away thy sticks it to all surfaces...
I haven't dealt with or seen the chip-it kit so might be one worth suggesting to the boys at work that wanna do it, the common one I see and have nO end of drama with is predominantly the steibauer

you seem pretty sharp mate, so why don't mits run all their diesels on the low ash Mobil 1?

My local dealer was looking at a catch can solution as it is the only legal way to keep the oil mist and carbon apart.

Plenty of people are a bit cranky about this issue and it is aimed at Mitsubishi - NOT you.

Thanks for posting. it is appreciated. Keep it going.